That angry vegan phase...

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ThisWalrus
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That angry vegan phase...

Post by ThisWalrus »

*Not meant to offend anyone, everyone has their own views on veganism*

I have been vegan for almost two years now, and I was just thinking about the angry, militant way i acted at first.
I was angry at family for still eating meat/dairy and trying SO hard to convert them, pressuring them to change their views, and i was sharing so many shocking facebook posts, getting in arguments, being passive aggressive etc.
I was a literal nightmare for like six months about food and vegan issues, and became that "better than you" vegan...

Looking back i am embarrassed about how i acted and I have taken a more moderate approach in the last year, and i now know that how i acted at the beginning is not effective and really just pushes people away.

Did anyone else go through this phase? Or do you still think that the more aggressive activism is the most effective?
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brimstoneSalad
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Re: That angry vegan phase...

Post by brimstoneSalad »

I think that's almost universal. Most vegans I've met went through that and then mellowed out.

However, it seems to be less likely for people who went vegetarian first for a long time then vegan. The smaller steps somebody takes, the less likely it seems they'll get militant about it.
This could be a contributing factor to why people who go vegetarian first then vegan are more likely to stick with it. Being militant isn't just bad activism, it can burn people out.
veganomics
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Re: That angry vegan phase...

Post by veganomics »

I was hyper militant for the first couple years. I converted a lot of people, quickly, but a lot of them seemed to fall off just as quickly, especially as soon as I was no longer around. I was essentially bullying people into being vegan.

The last few years I've been much more passive, and I've still seen a good number of people convert, although much fewer, and much more slowly, to being vegan, vegetarian, veganish... etc. Their conversion seems to have stuck, on average, a bit better though.

I can't dismiss the militant approach for certain, as I've noticed that there are people who are much more comfortable being animal consumption apologists around me in these later years, whereas in the first few years I was so aggressive about shutting that shit down that people at least understood they could not defend it rationally, even if they did not change their habits.
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brimstoneSalad
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Re: That angry vegan phase...

Post by brimstoneSalad »

veganomics wrote: Tue May 01, 2018 9:28 pm I can't dismiss the militant approach for certain, as I've noticed that there are people who are much more comfortable being animal consumption apologists around me in these later years, whereas in the first few years I was so aggressive about shutting that shit down that people at least understood they could not defend it rationally, even if they did not change their habits.
I think a mixed approach is usually called for when people start up with the apologia.

It's important to establish whether they're asking you what you think about it because it's something they heard and seemed convincing to them (which you always want to encourage, because we don't want people to have unresolved doubts they're afraid to bring up), or if it's an argument they're making to try to convince you/defend themselves rather than get your answer to.

The former are often accused of "concern trolling", but that's just being uncharitable. Concern trolls might exist, but we should never assume that because doing so just shuts down people with real concerns (I'm sure you wouldn't do that, just making a note of that since it's something that comes up).

By the way, welcome to the forum! You should post an intro (if you're so inclined).
Roman0vmarisa
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Re: That angry vegan phase...

Post by Roman0vmarisa »

Yes I absolutely did! I was vegetarian since I was 9 and I went vegan when I was about 22 (I’m 26 now) and when I was a vegetarian I never acted like that. When I became vegan, however, I joined a bunch of vegan groups on Facebook and I was overwhelmed with the atrocities and saw how other vegans were acting (the over the top vegans who don’t actually help the vegan movement). I like to think of it as the “grief of awareness” phase and while it IS overwhelming, it’s not helpful. Sure, we need all different kinds of activism to reach different types of people BUT I think that the aggressive, over the top, vegans are hurting veganism more than helping it.

I actually wrote a very short (and fast) blog post on it 😂
Jamie in Chile
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Re: That angry vegan phase...

Post by Jamie in Chile »

veganomics wrote: Tue May 01, 2018 9:28 pm I can't dismiss the militant approach for certain, as I've noticed that there are people who are much more comfortable being animal consumption apologists around me in these later years, whereas in the first few years I was so aggressive about shutting that shit down that people at least understood they could not defend it rationally, even if they did not change their habits.
It may be that the aggressive you was just making people not wanting to get into an argument, not that they thought that they couldn't defend themselves. It may be better to let people open up and talk.

I think a lot of us are in a similar boat. We think that an overly militant approach is probably worse, but we aren't sure since there isn't any real evidence to enable a definite conclusion.
Jamie in Chile
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Re: That angry vegan phase...

Post by Jamie in Chile »

When I first converted, I did so quite quietly. I didn't want to be "meat eating is wrong" on facebook one minute and then a week later feeling sick and going back to eating meat. However over time, I realize that the health risks were overstated by a biased society that is looking to keep meat, and that vegan diet and lifestyle worked for me.

Once I had three months under my belt I emailed my close family in a group email. I explained my reasons and cited some specific things that happen in factory farms and even added a little comment like "hope to inspire others to think about these issues" or something of that nature. I wrote to my two closest friends in the UK with my reasoning. The one replied that, since he doesn't eat vegetables, he would have little left to eat if he gave up meat. The other never responded to me. When I talk on the phone, the issues don't come up much. I think I need a face to face to go over these issues.

I live in Chile, and my close family are in the UK where I haven't been for three years. I have had almost zero face to face contact with close family and friends since I began vegetarian and mostly vegan. I think that makes the influencing harder for sure, especially the gentler kind of influencing.

My brother has eaten less meat since I changed, although when I asked him if it was because of me he wasn't sure, as there were other factors. My parents are saying that they only eat meat occassionally now. Again, I am not sure to what extent if any this is due to me.

A year after I became vegetarian, I started a blog. The idea behind the blog was to promote vegetarianism and animal rights to my facebook contacts in the UK. To try and be less intrusive, I posted one or two sentences and a link to the whole article. I like this approach as a means to discuss controversial subjects.

I started posting once a week, and planned to write 30 or 40 blogs and take it from there. Here is the first blog https://whytryveg.wordpress.com/2017/02 ... blog-post/ and from there you can click through to the others. I tried to avoid militancy and keep it light, but that being said I wasn't about to skirt ethical issues.

I did it for 2 months, then I found out how to check the amount of page views on the website. The first blog had about 20 or 30 page views which I thought was amazingly high given that I only shared it with my English-speaking contacts on facebook which is about 40 or 50 people. More than half of people read it. Or at least clicked on it. However the pattern of page views declined dramatically after that and the last few blogs each got about 2-3 page views only. When I saw this, and also thought about how few likes and comments there were on facebook, I discontinued the blog.

I did have a success with my cousin in Chile who went vegetarian but she has eaten meat at least twice in the last weeks including once in a restaurant with me. It was strange that she did this without even telling me she was no longer vegetarian, having told me previously she would never go back and was hopeful of going vegan one day. In the spirit of non-militancy, I decided not to say anything at all and pick up the conversation later. I think that will show a better, non-judgemental approach. It's easier done in this case as she is someone I will see regularly.
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MorganAlix
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Re: That angry vegan phase...

Post by MorganAlix »

I totally can rely on this "angry vegan" phase.

I've been vegetarian for 5 years, but i've never been in any way an activist during these years, since i lived in a very non vegetarian social environnement. I didn't want to be the center of the attention, and attract some disrespect and agressivity. So i never talked about it, unless the topic was brought by the other person.

But six months ago, i became interrested again in the topic of animal rights, and i decided to transition to veganism. I quickly became overwhelmed by tha atrocities towards animals (as said Roman). I began to talk with my boyfriend about animal exploitation, at first very calmly et reasonnable, but each time he was skeptical or indifferent, i began to be nervous, oversentitive, aggressive. I cried one time, although he didn't mean to hurt me in any way. I just could'nt control myself.
When you're convinced that you're right, it hard to see other people, and especially the ones you love, don't understand your point.

Now i have changed my approach, and i try not to be too sensitive. I'm still horrified by all this cruelty, but i regret that i've been aggressive with him.
Everyone is on his/her own journey. Only one year ago, i didn't know (or realise)that dairy is a cruel industry.
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