A discussion on TFES forum

[EquALLity]

I don't think it'd be beneficial to veganism if people who believe the Earth is flat went vegan, since it's a pseudoscience, and the vegan movement unfortunately already reeks of that in certain aspects.

There are round earthers there. Besides, even if there are vegans who believe in the earth being flat or anything else odd, that doesn't mean it will look like we all do. It's illogical to assume all people in any group believe in the same things. Anyone who would think that way wouldn't listen to logic anyway.

There are atheists who believe in soulmates, ghosts, fate, aliens, all sorts of things. Not that any of those are bad or odd, just that that doesn't mean we all do. I'm sure there have also been atheists who have killed people too.

I have been considering joining since I saw the thread since it seems no one else is. I'm not sure yet. The people there are presenting arguments that are easily refutable and it's annoying me. They seem like they wouldn't listen, but I'm trying to stay up all night tonight to get back on schedule anyway.

Oh, there are? I thought it was an echo chamber for flat earthers.
I don't want to convince any flat earthers to go vegan though.

Anyway, like brimstone said, flat earthism is pretty different from believing in ghosts etc.. That stuff is mainstream bullshit.

And of course people shouldn't see veganism as invalid because they learned about it from a flat earther, but many people will who might otherwise be convinced by a seemingly reasonable person.

[brimstoneSalad]

There are round earthers there.

Oh, there are? I thought it was an echo chamber for flat earthers.
I don't want to convince any flat earthers to go vegan though.

Surprisingly, it seems to be mostly skeptics who are trying to talk reason into the Flat Earthers. Smart on the part of the admins to allow real discussion there, it has given them great Google Search rankings due to the activity.

I don't think there's much danger of converting the Flat Earthers.

[EquALLity]

There are round earthers there.

Oh, there are? I thought it was an echo chamber for flat earthers.
I don't want to convince any flat earthers to go vegan though.

Surprisingly, it seems to be mostly skeptics who are trying to talk reason into the Flat Earthers. Smart on the part of the admins to allow real discussion there, it has given them great Google Search rankings due to the activity.

I don't think there's much danger of converting the Flat Earthers.

Are you sure about that, though? People with crazy conspiracy theories might be more likely to be swayed into other non-mainstream positions.

[brimstoneSalad]

Are you sure about that, though? People with crazy conspiracy theories might be more likely to be swayed into other non-mainstream positions.

Like Cholesterol and Saturated fat denialism, or paleo diets, sure. The nutritional arguments for veganism (with the exception of fish, which is more promoted because it's high in protein and lower in saturated fat and contains EFAs) are pretty mainstream health authority things. They'll almost certainly reject any health authority outright.

[EquALLity]

Are you sure about that, though? People with crazy conspiracy theories might be more likely to be swayed into other non-mainstream positions.

Like Cholesterol and Saturated fat denialism, or paleo diets, sure. The nutritional arguments for veganism (with the exception of fish, which is more promoted because it's high in protein and lower in saturated fat and contains EFAs) are pretty mainstream health authority things. They'll almost certainly reject any health authority outright.

That makes sense, but what about the ethical arguments?

[brimstoneSalad]

That makes sense, but what about the ethical arguments?

Flat Earthers are mostly theists who believe god gave man animals to eat, and so it is ethical to do so.

Only the normal people there (the skeptics) are likely to be swayed by secular arguments.

I'd say if you accidentally convinced one Flat Earther, but convinced ten normal people, that might even out.

[ThinkAboutThis]

In this video, by Timothy Shieff, he states at 1:01, "there's as much evidence that proves that it's flat, than proves that it's round". It's frustrating because I really like Tim, so I hate seeing him be so easily misled.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIef3oeUFq0

[brimstoneSalad]

In this video, by Timothy Shieff, he states at 1:01, "there's as much evidence that proves that it's flat, than proves that it's round". It's frustrating because I really like Tim, so I hate seeing him be so easily misled.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIef3oeUFq0

Is that the OP, or is that another vegan who thinks the Earth is flat?

This makes us look really bad, it seems we need to do something about this, or people are going to think vegans are all idiots if this stuff catches on.

[ThinkAboutThis]

Is that the OP, or is that another vegan who thinks the Earth is flat?

It's another person, because the OP claims to only be a 16 year old in that thread on theflatearthsociety.com:

This also applies to children and teenagers (I am 16).

Based off the comment section of Tim Shieff's video, there are a lot of vegans agreeing with it (or "not knowing either way"). I think what happens, and this is just speculation, but it seems that they allow their skepticism to lead them down this path where they are no longer sure what to believe, almost like a mental blank of knowledge, and they become confused, which makes them vulnerable to ideas like the FE hypothesis. It's happened to me a few times in my life, but I've never been sure if it's because I was too skeptical or too open minded.

...it seems we need to do something about this

Any ideas? Tim watches my videos, so there's a direct contact to him there.

[brimstoneSalad]

Any ideas? Tim watches my videos, so there's a direct contact to him there.

You could definitely make a video about it.
Maybe about the whole issue of minds being, in Dawkins' words, so open the brain falls out?

As vegans, we need to stay within sight of sanity for the animals. Even if the Earth were flat (what would be the moral relevance of that anyway?), we should probably just go along with the Earth being round (or keep our mouths shut about it and let others deal with that) and not look like loonies so that we can address the more important issue: veganism.

Like if I lived in the Middle ages, I would probably have just gone along with religion since if I came out as an Atheist there not only would I probably be killed, but I wouldn't be able to reach anybody with a compassionate vegetarian message (given veganism wasn't conceived of yet ).