Re: Ukraine reprezent
Posted: Sun Oct 04, 2020 12:18 pm
The difference is that your example is a non-sequitur. Despite the reproductive shortcomings, homosexuality is very natural (or common in nature).
The difference is that your example is a non-sequitur. Despite the reproductive shortcomings, homosexuality is very natural (or common in nature).
I hope you haven't been in any sense convinced by Benatar's Asymmetry argument, that one has been widely debunked. Here's an outline of some of the core logical problems and misrepresentations it makes: wiki/index.php/Antinatalism#Benatar.27s_AsymmetryArmoreska wrote: ↑Sat Oct 03, 2020 1:45 pm I didn't say I dislike it, just less fond of the approach. They're still better than whatever I left out of that list.
NU or NC just seems logical based on my experience.
I like what this guy wrote:
http://jiwoonhwang.org/pro-mortalism/
I didn't say I had a channel per se.
Because you haven't looked into it, or because you like the current system?
You're right. I'm already minimizing its use. What do you suggest?
I'd like to listen to a discussion on that. Reading a document is not very appealing.brimstoneSalad wrote: ↑Tue Oct 06, 2020 12:25 amI hope you haven't been in any sense convinced by Benatar's Asymmetry argument, that one has been widely debunked. Here's an outline of some of the core logical problems and misrepresentations it makes: http://philosophicalvegan.com/wiki/inde ... _AsymmetryArmoreska wrote: ↑Sat Oct 03, 2020 1:45 pm I didn't say I dislike it, just less fond of the approach. They're still better than whatever I left out of that list.
NU or NC just seems logical based on my experience.
I like what this guy wrote:
http://jiwoonhwang.org/pro-mortalism/
I haven't looked into it much. I've never seen any compelling arguments and I've never met an intelligent person who believes in anarchy.
Wash with bicarbonate. After finish with a mixture of 50% apple cider vinegar and 50% water. Works great for hair that tends to get greasy at times.
Sunflower oil + weird dangerous soda from the soap store. Mix and done?Jebus wrote: ↑Tue Oct 06, 2020 10:59 amI haven't looked into it much. I've never seen any compelling arguments and I've never met an intelligent person who believes in anarchy.
Wash with bicarbonate. After finish with a mixture of 50% apple cider vinegar and 50% water. Works great for hair that tends to get greasy at times.
If you can find caustic soda where you live, it will be easy for you to make hard soap. Liquid soap requires potassium hydroxide and is slightly more difficult.
It may be easier to understand if you read the article. If you have questions, though, feel free to ask them. It would be very useful feedback.Wiki wrote: Where the claim meets a contradiction is that this is not always the case in a comparative assessment. In order to even break even in quantitative analysis, a life would have to contain twice as much pleasure as pain. However, contrary to Benatar's claims, if a life is sufficiently happy, it obviously IS better than non-life even if we blindly accept unjustified double counting of pain; that is if the two scenarios are assessed honestly with a quantitative comparison rather than ad-hoc sanitization of the results.
___________________Existence __________Non-Existence
10 units Pleasure 10 _______________0
2 units of Pain ____-2 _______________2
Total _____________8 (Very Good life) 2 (Slightly good non-existence)
Here existence is clearly preferred (offering more good) than non-existence. So if Bob lives a great life of happiness and contentment and gets a paper-cut once, it IS better that he had lived than not. This should be intuitively obvious, but even if it isn't intuitively obvious it's the only honest conclusion following from a consistent application of measurement standards. Benatar is simply wrong that it is guaranteed that life will always be less than non-life, the result is leaving the question of whether we should or should not have children up to empirical contention. It is plausible (or at least an open question) that a significant number of humans and non-human animals live lives they would consider at least twice as happy and pleasurable as they are sad, and so if used consistently, an honest interpretation of Benatar's asymmetry does not result in broad antinatalism.
The only way Benatar's asymmetry comes to the certain conclusions he wants (that life is always a bad gambit vs. non-life) is to engage in not one, but two forms of unjustified manipulation: Double counting pain AND assessing the results only qualitatively (good or bad) rather than quantitatively (a spectrum).
Intuition is a poor reason for rejecting something when you don't have a sound argument, particularly when the stakes are so high. It's tantamount to blind faith or spiritual gnosis.Armoreska wrote:Intuition? How much of the ultimate suffering are you willing to trade for a lot of ultimate happiness?brimstoneSalad wrote:Why does NU seem more logical based on your experience? That implies that something in your experience demonstrates a contradiction in classical utilitarianism