Page 2 of 2

Re: Food replacements

Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2015 4:54 pm
by brimstoneSalad
PrincessPeach wrote: I use dr. bronners castile peppermint soap and baking soda for my laundry and to wash myself and teeth.. Hippy soap!
I love a warm wet rag of dr bronners castile peppermint soap massaged into the face and neck for 5 minutes, amazing!
There is nothing wrong with Dr bronners now is there?!
Sorry, yes. :(

https://www.drbronner.com/DBMS/PEPPERMINT/OLPE32.html
See the ingredients:
Water, Organic Coconut Oil*, Potassium Hydroxide**, Organic Palm Kernel Oil*, Organic Olive Oil*, Mentha Arvensis, Organic Hemp Oil, Organic Jojoba Oil, Mentha Piperita, Citric Acid, Tocopherol
They use Palm Kernel Oil.
Coconut is not as bad, but doesn't solve the problem (coconut oil is somewhat fungible with palm oil, although the demands are not as high yet -- we can't just switch to coconut and expect that to solve the problem because then they'll just start burning rain forests to grow more coconuts instead).
We have to use oils that aren't grown in these tropical regions. Olive oil is popular (but IMO that's good to eat, so why waste it on soap?). Soybean oil, corn oil (less edible, so might as well use it for soap).

Pretty much any soap that actually works decently is made with tropical oils. It's the sodium palmitate, and the sodium laurate. They are very effective surfactants; they put others to shame.

Baking soda is sodium bicarbonate. It's not very potent. Use sodium carbonate (washing soda) for laundry. And boil it, along with the nearly useless tropical-oil-free soaps.

Re: Food replacements

Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2015 5:50 pm
by EquALLity
brimstoneSalad wrote:There's a recent episode of VICE on this issue.
VICE season 3 episode 6 - The Post-Antibiotic World & Indonesia's Palm Bomb
If you can find it, please link it for others (I couldn't find a link).
You watch VICE? :D

I can't find a link either, but if you subscribe to HBO, I think it should be free on demand. Just search VICE and it should come up as an episode.

I actually haven't seen that one, and a few other new ones. I have some catching up to do.

Interesting info.
brimstoneSalad wrote:If you use "sustainable" palm oil instead, it makes absolutely NO difference whatsoever. Demand is still X, supply is still Y. Only if everybody only used sustainable palm oil would it matter,
Really? There is no distinction made? Even if you buy from a company that specifically say they use sustainable? Why?

Re: Food replacements

Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2015 6:08 pm
by brimstoneSalad
EquALLity wrote: Really? There is no distinction made? Even if you buy from a company that specifically say they use sustainable? Why?
It's fungible, and it's produced in the same way from the same kind of land resources, which are limited. It doesn't reduce demand. It's completely useless.

I'm a little amazed that the journalists and regulators dealing with the issue don't seem to understand that concept.

If you don't understand, you might want to start a thread about this, because it will take a long time to explain.

Re: Food replacements

Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2015 11:23 pm
by PrincessPeach
brimstoneSalad wrote:
https://www.drbronner.com/DBMS/PEPPERMINT/OLPE32.html
See the ingredients:
Water, Organic Coconut Oil*, Potassium Hydroxide**, Organic Palm Kernel Oil*, Organic Olive Oil*, Mentha Arvensis, Organic Hemp Oil, Organic Jojoba Oil, Mentha Piperita, Citric Acid, Tocopherol
They use Palm Kernel Oil.
Coconut is not as bad, but doesn't solve the problem (coconut oil is somewhat fungible with palm oil, although the demands are not as high yet -- we can't just switch to coconut and expect that to solve the problem because then they'll just start burning rain forests to grow more coconuts instead).
We have to use oils that aren't grown in these tropical regions. Olive oil is popular (but IMO that's good to eat, so why waste it on soap?). Soybean oil, corn oil (less edible, so might as well use it for soap).

Pretty much any soap that actually works decently is made with tropical oils. It's the sodium palmitate, and the sodium laurate. They are very effective surfactants; they put others to shame.

Baking soda is sodium bicarbonate. It's not very potent. Use sodium carbonate (washing soda) for laundry. And boil it, along with the nearly useless tropical-oil-free soaps.
This doesn't make me happy.
Dr bronners is big too! What am I going to do about Earth balance ? They all say natural oil blend and the first ingredient after that is palm oil..?
I know what baking soda is & that is what I use it's all I've ever had and all I've ever used I'll look into getting some sodium carbonate..
I live in the tropics there are some many palm trees in Florida why isn't some one making palm oil in Florida..?

Re: Food replacements

Posted: Sat Apr 25, 2015 3:55 am
by brimstoneSalad
PrincessPeach wrote: This doesn't make me happy.
Dr bronners is big too! What am I going to do about Earth balance ? They all say natural oil blend and the first ingredient after that is palm oil..?
You'd need to stop using almost all processed foods. And almost all commercial soaps.

Earth balance, what a crock. Nothing heart healthy about it, or remotely eco friendly.

Use vegenaise (or make your own) as a spreadable fatty substance.
http://followyourheart.com/comparison-charts/
Although, it's better to make your own as a nut butter in the blender.
Mix up some flax and hemp seeds, maybe some cashews, a bit of salt, lemon juice, etc.

As far as I know, followyourheart never uses palm oil, but you could call them to confirm that.

*Nope, I was wrong. They use it in their cheeses: http://followyourheart.com/products/moz ... shreds-27/
Assholes.

You have to be a special kind of evil to knowingly put palm oil in your consumer products, seeing as its so incredibly unhealthy and destructive to the environment (though some people may delude themselves into thinking "sustainable" has any meaning with regard to palm oil). It gives you a big leg up in terms of market appeal because it's incredibly delicious, but again, evil. We're talking cigarette company kind of evil here.
I'm guessing followyoutheart are delusional about it.
http://followyourheart.com/palmoil/ Yep, delusional.
"Our cigarettes are low tar! Doctor recommended!" :roll:
PrincessPeach wrote:I live in the tropics there are some many palm trees in Florida why isn't some one making palm oil in Florida..?
Not tropical enough.
http://greenpalm.org/about-palm-oil/wha ... -oil-grown
Maybe they could at the very tip of Florida, just maybe (I don't think so). But the problem is that demand for palm oil is endlessly growing, and it's demanding more and more land. There's really limited land where it can grow, and wherever you grow it you'll be chopping down rain forest or destroying some other precious natural environment.
If you wanted to destroy and fill in the everglades to grow palm, that might work, but how horrible would that be?

There are a few possibly viable ways we could fix the problem:

1. Genetically engineer or breed the palm plant so it will grow at higher latitudes (Florida, California, maybe even Texas). This would pretty much save all of the rain forests, and with locally grown palm oil, the U.S. could even ban import. This has failed so far, the conditions just not being good for these plants, and plants that will grow in those conditions not producing good yield.

2. Yeast: http://www.theguardian.com/sustainable- ... tive-yeast
Oil from yeast would be pretty much the most environmentally friendly and sustainable source you could imagine.
This is the most promising, but it's years away from commercial viability, and that's if it can compete on price.

3. Chemical engineering. Find something to replace palm oil. Either a means of enzymatically saturating oils without hydrogenation, or something else that produces the necessary texture and melting qualities. Starches, gums, waxes, soaps, sugars, alcohols, proteins, something.

Re: Food replacements

Posted: Sat Apr 25, 2015 2:30 pm
by EquALLity
brimstoneSalad wrote: If you don't understand, you might want to start a thread about this, because it will take a long time to explain.
Yeah, this one has been hijacked. I'll make another now.

Re: Food replacements

Posted: Tue May 05, 2015 7:39 pm
by EquALLity
:lol:

Re: Food replacements

Posted: Wed May 06, 2015 12:48 am
by brimstoneSalad
Lol but deserted islands have to be milked otherwise I wouldn't get enough ancestors
That's the funniest thing I've seen in those comics. Is this one new? He/she is getting good.

Re: Food replacements

Posted: Wed May 06, 2015 7:01 am
by EquALLity
^Yep, it's a new one.

On the Facebook page, new ones are uploaded all the time (if you just want to see the newer ones).