Philosophical Vegan Forum

Several months ago I posted on here about being an omnivore and so on;
only to have Brimstone and Minibos hand me my ass.
Well after months of contemplation I've decided to try going vegan again.
I have tried and failed on several occasions, but I'd love to give it another go.
I have already pretty much cut out Dairy I drink only almond milk for everything , but Coffee I still need cream.
I am basically looking for support and direction. I need Shopping tips on where I can find affordable
produce and nuts. ( Why are almonds so fucking expensive?!?!?) yes, I did need to use the F word because only
then can it express my frustration on the price of almonds.
I'd also like to know of any particularly easy to make dishes that will help transitioning into the life style.
The Vegan Atheist on one of his videos said that he enjoys food much better now than he did before he became
vegan ,and I'd highly doubt you would be a vegan if that weren't the case, so I'd be very appreciative if you shared
some of these tasty meals you speak of.
Any websites that aren't trying to sell me the vegan diet would be appreciated as well. I need information about being a vegan not a sales pitch
I'm already sold on it.

Thank you guys so much for your time and or effort in helping me! (That maybe premature but hey here is hoping!)

Nice effort on turning vegan!!!

I am no expert cook myself although I agree with the VA in that I enjoy food more now. I enjoy experimenting and searching for new recipes. Just Google vegan food and you will find lots of stuff you can try.

Instead of almond milk you can try cashew milk. It is a bit more vegan, easier to make, and less costly on a nutrient to dollar ratio as the whole nut is used, whereas in almond milk a big part of the nut is thrown away (or used for cookies).

Again I applaud you on your effort. Have you seen Earthlings? I'm just putting that out since you will be more likely to stick to veganism once you are convinced that it is the morally right thing to do.

Happy to hear that you are still at it.
For coffee, i used soy or almond milk's designed to mix well with coffee. Silk brand may be available near you.
If you have a China town, or Indian supermarket in your area, I would definitely check out those places for cheap nut prices. My suggestion with easy receipes is to try and make vegan versions of the things you already enjoy. Gardiene makes really good mock meat foods.

I love oatmeal (large flakes) in the morning. I add an assortment of fruit and berries into it, as well as walnuts, and ground flax. If you like I can detail exactly the way I do it (Ive sort of mastered it over the years).

For lunch I often eat a sandwich. I make it with the unfortunately named Genesis 1:29 bread (made by Food for Life). I add a layer of basil pesto (no cheese in it), hummus, lettuce, gardiene protein, tomato and a pickle. On the side I eat a carrot, radishes and a couple of green onions. My wife loves this lunch too.

For dinner we often make either: pizza, pasta, veggie stew with beans, quiche, stir fry, rappini fried with garlic and onions.... just to name a few.

Ive found over the years, and perhaps others have a different experience, but we've bought a lot of vegan cook books, and we use them for inspiration and use what ingredients we have, rather then following to a "t" the receipes. Substitute what you like.

What kind of information are you looking on veganism? I could perhaps suggest the book The Vegan Sourcebook.

Thanks for responding! No, I haven't seen Earthlings, however it's the moral argument that
is the reason I'm trying to go vegan yet again. When I researched the vegan claims as far as
health is concerned I found the same thing as they say for every other diet.
The studies aren't nearly as thorough as one may think, (i.e the studies only referring to people as meat eaters
and not taking a better count as to what they eat. You can say a meat eater sure, however if the person's diet
largely consists of double bacon cheeseburgers and pizza and monsters and mt dew well then of course vegan
will be healthier.) but the idea behind torturing animals for their milk and killing them for their flesh
is an extremely hard one to argue against.
Believe me I tried it in every way shape and form to argue for the factory farming and I can't. Even the ones
that treat their animals well.
there is also the environmental hazard to clearing tons of land for cows and pigs and the toxic waste that is created
for feeding them.
Also, the inefficiency of having to feed our food is one that bothers me as well.
On an unrelated topic I know these are in no way shape or form vegan friendly, but https://www.exoprotein.com/
They are protein bars made with cricket flour. I know ew crickets right? Basically all the arguments of eating livestock is gone with these.
I'm unsure how vegans feel about the sentience of insects. I'm not sure if there is a study that can prove they are more than mindless drones
I'll have to look it up. Eww crickets ><

[quote="TheVeganAtheist"]For lunch I often eat a sandwich. I make it with the unfortunately named Genesis 1:29 bread (made by Food for Life). I add a layer of basil pesto (no cheese in it), hummus, lettuce, gardiene protein, tomato and a pickle. On the side I eat a carrot, radishes and a couple of green onions. My wife loves this lunch too.[quote="TheVeganAtheist"]

this type of info! it sounds amazing!

TheVeganAtheist wrote:Happy to hear that you are still at it.
For coffee, i used soy or almond milk's designed to mix well with coffee. Silk brand may be available near you.
If you have a China town, or Indian supermarket in your area, I would definitely check out those places for cheap nut prices. My suggestion with easy receipes is to try and make vegan versions of the things you already enjoy. Gardiene makes really good mock meat foods.

I love oatmeal (large flakes) in the morning. I add an assortment of fruit and berries into it, as well as walnuts, and ground flax. If you like I can detail exactly the way I do it (Ive sort of mastered it over the years).

For lunch I often eat a sandwich. I make it with the unfortunately named Genesis 1:29 bread (made by Food for Life). I add a layer of basil pesto (no cheese in it), hummus, lettuce, gardiene protein, tomato and a pickle. On the side I eat a carrot, radishes and a couple of green onions. My wife loves this lunch too.

For dinner we often make either: pizza, pasta, veggie stew with beans, quiche, stir fry, rappini fried with garlic and onions.... just to name a few.

Ive found over the years, and perhaps others have a different experience, but we've bought a lot of vegan cook books, and we use them for inspiration and use what ingredients we have, rather then following to a "t" the receipes. Substitute what you like.

What kind of information are you looking on veganism? I could perhaps suggest the book The Vegan Sourcebook.

Other information I'm looking for consists of: Getting started guides, how to over come urges or peer pressure since all of my friends are alpha male dicks that would call me a pussy for trying to go vegan, fighting intense cravings or controlling Hangry ( Hangry = Angry when you're hungry.) fits.
I'm sure there is a period of adjustment to go through and this will all be over but any sign of encouragement, motivation, or anything to help get
through the initial phases of the transition.
Also information on what kinds of beans are good to eat daily. I mostly love black beans but hear confliction information about them

Well to be completely honest most information I've gotten since I've been researching the vegan diet and human health in general ( the latter more) has been conflicting. Recently an article was published about how we need the fatty foods and that not eating meats with fats and cholesterol is bad news, but this is the opposite of what I've learned since the 1980's.

That's great to hear!

wfatheist wrote: Other information I'm looking for consists of: Getting started guides, how to over come urges or peer pressure since all of my friends are alpha male dicks that would call me a pussy for trying to go vegan, fighting intense cravings or controlling Hangry ( Hangry = Angry when you're hungry.) fits.
I'm sure there is a period of adjustment to go through and this will all be over but any sign of encouragement, motivation, or anything to help get
through the initial phases of the transition.
Also information on what kinds of beans are good to eat daily. I mostly love black beans but hear confliction information about them

Well to be completely honest most information I've gotten since I've been researching the vegan diet and human health in general ( the latter more) has been conflicting. Recently an article was published about how we need the fatty foods and that not eating meats with fats and cholesterol is bad news, but this is the opposite of what I've learned since the 1980's.

Its been a while, but I think Colleen Goudreau had a helpful podcast you can probably still find: http://www.joyfulvegan.com/
In regards to urges, they subside and are replaced with vegan urges. Try not to dwell. I read somewhere that food cravings last 3 weeks, and if you can work through it, then you will have a better time. Also next time you have an urge for something not vegan, think about the harm that was caused to the animal and that usually killed any desire to consume it. You have to rewire your brain in a way to stop perceiving animal products as food items. When I see a meat, I see a dead body, not food. It doesn't interest me in the slightest now.
Peer pressure is the hardest. For me dealing with non-vegans has always been the hardest part of being a vegan. My suggestion is to expand your peer group to include others (preferably vegan or vegetarian). In regards to hangry, keep some vegan bars and snacks with you and anytime you feel the hanger come on, eat something. The best encouragement and support will be other vegans or vegetarians in your life. Try to find a community in your area, or start one. Go to animal rights conferences, or vegetarian/vegan food festivals.
The more I read, watched and listened, the less I desired animal products, and the more confident I was dealing with others.

There is a lot of misinformation about meat, and its fueled by meat interest groups. I recently saw on tv a program about how saturated fat is good for you. Total bullshit. Abusing and misconstruing the results of studies to fit the needs of marketing.

Hi,

That's great to hear! Specialty breads are a good choice.
They're more expensive than other bread, sometimes two or three times as much... but:

1. Bread is really cheap anyway, so 2-3 times the cost of cheap is still pretty cheap.
2. They're more dense and filling than cheap bread (and of course more nutritious), so you're actually buying more. With other loafs, they're mostly just fluff.

You will usually find them in the freezer section, since they go bad fast.
I definitely recommend eating a lot of sandwiches.

Hummus and bean spreads are good, but it may take a while for your digestive system to adapt. Gas is a common complaint, which goes away after a few weeks.
Most people have digestive issues when they change diets, however they are changed. Our systems always take time to adapt, particularly the microbes we rely on. Pro-biotics may or may not be helpful for the transition.

Can you give me an idea of your daily food budget? Also, are you in the states?
I'll find some things local for you to eat that are convenient, nutritious, and within your budget.

I don't usually recommend what TheVeganAtheist suggested, because that's a relatively expensive shopping list (although no-doubt delicious). I usually go for cheaper stuff. I plain daily food budgets of around $2-$3. But, if you have more, there's all sorts of yummy stuff you can buy already prepared for convenience. If you go cheaper, you usually have to set aside some time each week to cook, and invest in a food processor (and a refrigerator/freezer if you don't have one).

Other random stuff:

• Price of nuts has increased substantially. You should probably buy online; shipping will usually be less than the margins you pay locally if you buy in a large bulk.
• I don't have a particular problem with people eating Oysters (if sustainably grown). Bugs are a little bigger issue, but not much; if people want to eat bugs, it doesn't bother me much (less intelligent, more sustainable). It's just the extreme absurdity of currently eaten animals that's the biggest concern, ethically, environmentally, health-wise.
• There is a movement of "cholesterol skepticism"; it's conspiracy theory nonsense and pseudoscience, along the lines of climate change skepticism and intelligent design. They offer no evidence supported competing theories to the mainstream (and well supported) lipid hypothesis. The Wikipedia page says it all: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Intern ... l_Skeptics
• Of course, it doesn't matter to me if cholesterol and saturated fat consumption are good or bad for people, since I'm not going to eat it anyway due to moral reasons. But, the overwhelming evidence that animal products are unhealthy (they're not the only thing that are unhealthy, of course, some plant products are bad for us too) does add insult to injury. People are not only harming animals and the environment around them, but directly harming their own health by consuming these things, which is a completely irrational lose-lose behavior.

Please let me know if I missed anything.

brimstoneSalad wrote:Hi,

That's great to hear! Specialty breads are a good choice.
They're more expensive than other bread, sometimes two or three times as much... but:

1. Bread is really cheap anyway, so 2-3 times the cost of cheap is still pretty cheap.
2. They're more dense and filling than cheap bread (and of course more nutritious), so you're actually buying more. With other loafs, they're mostly just fluff.

You will usually find them in the freezer section, since they go bad fast.
I definitely recommend eating a lot of sandwiches.

Hummus and bean spreads are good, but it may take a while for your digestive system to adapt. Gas is a common complaint, which goes away after a few weeks.
Most people have digestive issues when they change diets, however they are changed. Our systems always take time to adapt, particularly the microbes we rely on. Pro-biotics may or may not be helpful for the transition.

Can you give me an idea of your daily food budget? Also, are you in the states?
I'll find some things local for you to eat that are convenient, nutritious, and within your budget.

I don't usually recommend what TheVeganAtheist suggested, because that's a relatively expensive shopping list (although no-doubt delicious). I usually go for cheaper stuff. I plain daily food budgets of around $2-$3. But, if you have more, there's all sorts of yummy stuff you can buy already prepared for convenience. If you go cheaper, you usually have to set aside some time each week to cook, and invest in a food processor (and a refrigerator/freezer if you don't have one).

Other random stuff:

• Price of nuts has increased substantially. You should probably buy online; shipping will usually be less than the margins you pay locally if you buy in a large bulk.
• I don't have a particular problem with people eating Oysters (if sustainably grown). Bugs are a little bigger issue, but not much; if people want to eat bugs, it doesn't bother me much (less intelligent, more sustainable). It's just the extreme absurdity of currently eaten animals that's the biggest concern, ethically, environmentally, health-wise.
• There is a movement of "cholesterol skepticism"; it's conspiracy theory nonsense and pseudoscience, along the lines of climate change skepticism and intelligent design. They offer no evidence supported competing theories to the mainstream (and well supported) lipid hypothesis. The Wikipedia page says it all: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Intern ... l_Skeptics
• Of course, it doesn't matter to me if cholesterol and saturated fat consumption are good or bad for people, since I'm not going to eat it anyway due to moral reasons. But, the overwhelming evidence that animal products are unhealthy (they're not the only thing that are unhealthy, of course, some plant products are bad for us too) does add insult to injury. People are not only harming animals and the environment around them, but directly harming their own health by consuming these things, which is a completely irrational lose-lose behavior.

Please let me know if I missed anything.

I'm from NJ, Marlton NJ to be exact. I have a really low budget 2-3 bucks a meal would be great. I am a little bit more extreme in my atheist views than most so I won't be buying the bread the VA suggested. Yeah, about the saturated fats thing. It set off my bullshit alarm instantly.
I did mention inconsistent data as far as "scientific studies" when it came to meat vs vegan diets, however a vast number of
vegan converts reported not having to take blood pressure medication anymore. This is evidence enough for me that having
saturated fat and high cholesterol foods is not a good thing.
as far as oysters go heck no. I hate seafood
and bugs are just ew.